Comments on: How long do you have to study Chinese to make it useful?

By: Olle Linge

Olle Linge — Wed, 30 Aug 2023 10:03:21 +0000

In reply to Xiaowang. One of the problems with talking about how long it takes is that the proficiency levels are hard to define. HSK and other similar tests make it look easy because you can see how many words and grammar patterns you need for each level, but this can be very misleading. What does knowing a word mean? Can you recognise it in speech? Read it? Type it? Write it by hand? Use it in different types of constructions? All of the above? There are many things about language proficiency which have nothing to do with the quantity of words known. Anyway, this is why I kept it deliberately vague in the article. We could of course still meaningfully talk about a level between my second and third milestone and call it upper-intermediate. While it's hard to say something specific, I think it's safe to say that it's much closer to the 1,000-hour milestone than the 10,000-hour one. Maybe something like 2,000 hours? The law of diminishing returns really starts kicking in after that. I obviously chose each milestone to be exactly an order of magnitude larger than the previous one out of convenience and neatness, but I think that's generally true. I wrote about this a bit more in the article about traversing the intermediate plateau here: https://www.hackingchinese.com/how-to-get-past-the-intermediate-chinese-learning-plateau/

By: Xiaowang

Xiaowang — Tue, 29 Aug 2023 06:52:12 +0000

This chimes with my experience. I work full time so learning Chinese is just a hobby. It took me roughly 4 years to lower intermediate level which I think is the level you are describing as the second step (1000 hours). However, reaching near native level is obviously quite far away. I‘d be interested to hear how many hours you think are necessary to reach upper intermediate -appreciating that study methods and goals can be very different once you are past the beginner stage. Very useful podcast. Thank you.

Which reminds me, I read somewhere that upper intermediate roughly equates to knowing 5000 words. Another very rough measure but I have an idea how long it would take me to get there using my current study methods.

By: David Feigelson

David Feigelson — Tue, 20 Jun 2017 02:19:00 +0000

Everyone uses their Chinese in different ways. Some people focus on reading and writing and can read Classical Chinese novels in the original. Other people focus on listening and speaking and you would think they are native speakers. If you are in a solid Chinese program you are probably getting a more well-rounded education. I think ultimately you have to come to your own definition of what being proficient in Chinese means. I mean you have to be motivated by something that pushes you further and outside a school curriculum. While I never got into reading comic books or literature, I remember buying a small pocket radio in Taiwan in 2009 and listening to local radio. Now it is 2017 and I still listen to Chinese radio on my smart phone. Just find your joy in learning Chinese or your interest will never leave the classroom.

By: Harland

Harland — Fri, 16 Jun 2017 07:23:53 +0000

The problem with learning Chinese is that for a long, long time learning Chinese was not about being proficient with the language. It was about becoming a Sinologist and reading classical Chinese literature. There is still a snobbery today in Chinese learning that looks down on mere ‘useful’ practitioners and assumes anyone who is learning *must* be pursuing an academic career as a linguist. The unspoken mentality pervades a lot of study materials, although this is getting slowly better.

I’d like to see a post on this phenomenon. I remember learning from a very popular book published in Beijing and on lesson 4 or so, the word “geography” was taught. This is for rank beginners, lesson freaking 4, a word like “geography”. I asked online why I was learning a totally useless word like this instead of something like, I don’t know, “where’s the bathroom”? I was told off in no uncertain terms and informed to go get a phrasebook if I wanted to learn like that. The word would become useful years later in my studies, I was told. Since something like 95% of Chinese learners never get past beginner level, I really questioned the validity of that assumption. BUT it all makes sense if you’re an academic pursuing a 4 year degree that will eventually end with you reading classical Chinese.